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TOPIC: GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!!

GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3647

  • anifer
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There has been numerous posts in the forum on the recent "ZETA INCIDENT" and to prevent further questions, with Cee's green go, I've decided to post the details here.

So our community knows, and so Juliette knows, that we love her, and we're here for her!

Saturday night, as you all know, we painted E-Fun "furfle" ;p.....

It was intended to be a jolly night of random frivolity and everyone turned up in good spirits, shared stories, made new acquaintances, and showed Cecilia the Thai scene.....

As the night grew longer, we decided to hop onto neighboring Zeta from E-fun to see what's going on.
I've previously heard mostly negative comments from this place, but am one of those who has to know for myself. Saturday night was my second, AND LAST!
I was just there a previous weekend and for my first time at the place, already got bad vibes; A table of locals were rude to me when I casually chatted with a lady (foreigner) who was at their table. Alright, didn't want any trouble so I let that slide, but not without giving them a "You're pathetic!"look. I guess that did the trick cos they backed off...pfff like I said so in the forum (Who will take me clubbing....)
All talk! Peacocks, Ugly ones at that, puffing their feathers but running away!

So Saturday, we were a sizable group and from what I recall had split into 2. I was with the 1st. Among the 2nd is my friend Juliette, and mostly other farangs with us that night. At the door, the bouncers refused to let her in, and others as well. Juliette's crime?
She looked too much like a man. The others? No Passport or ID.....ummm ok since when do they card? These were women aged in their late 20s and above who were refused on grounds of not presenting ID, when the crowd inside were mainly young teeny boppers or people who looked the like, slutting around everywhere! Heck, I wasn't carded!

Now, if you all think that's a messed up double standard or lack of consistency, and the worst part.....wait till you read this!

Juliette darling, this one's for you, luv!

My friend Juliette is a MTF Trans. And not only was she refused entrance based on her "gender", she was also told off by the bouncers. "They would happily welcome her back, if she were all garbed up in loud DRAG!"
OUTRAGE! OUTRAGE! OUTRAGE! OUTRAGE! OUTRAGE!

People, we have struggled since our emergence in the Prudish/Hypocritical Victorian age, Demanded Equality in the 60s, been beaten up, tortured, hurt, and even killed. And not until recent years have we begun to see a light at the end of our tunnel! We've dealt with so many blows from the bigotry of the heteros, for what?

To have to see it, and receive it within our own "Family"????

No We Don't! AND WE NEED TO SHOW THEM THAT WE DON"T PUT UP WITH THIS FORM OF DEGREDATION FROM OUR OWN KIND!

Let us honor those who have shed blood, tears, and sweat so we could have what we have today.

Let us stand by our friend Juliette, "You are beautiful, no matter what they say....." -or do!

Let us come together as a community.

GIRLCOTTTTT FUCKING ZETAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RIOOOOOOOOOOOOTTTT!!!!!!!!
or not.....:P
Ghandi's approach is cool too*

But whatever you do, remember that if we don't stand by our family, who would?
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3649

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this is incredibly fucked up.

juliette, i just want you to know i stand by you and you are more than welcome in our community. this site and community is meant to be an alternative to the close minded crap you get elsewhere. you're welcome here with us.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3650

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Well said!

It is shocking, having gone through so much prejudice ourselves...
that we then pass it on....

It is seriously shocking. Right to girlcott :)

JD is awesome and friendly, lots of fun! Its their loss not hers, i didn't like the place anyhow (so not really our loss!). It was overcrowded and the music sucked. the only cool thing was the dog outside that looked like a permed panda!

Kind of ironic that the dj was a guy, double standards :oP

he sucked too, couldn't beat match. LoL i could DJ better.

</end rant> :)
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3651

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TBH, I'm not surprised this happened. The lez scene in Bangkok is "clicky" to say the least and so many Thais are xenophobic and bigots, even amongst our own community. The image they like to portray that they are accepting of anyone is utter bullshit: they are not.

Hit them where it hurts - in their pockets. Don't spend money at their businesses. There are plenty of other clubs/pubs/bars that are more welcoming.

If the Thais want to be small-minded and live in their bubble, so be it. Their loss, not yours.

@Juliette: (((hug)))
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3652

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Was quite unbelievable, especially as half the girls inside have busted their (proverbial) balls to look as much like men as possible.
I went across to Zeta for the first time to see what it was like - the place answered the question without my needin to go in.
(i was absolutely unaware that the rest of us were IDd - what a load of crap)
E-fun was fun though.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3653

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@ Aimee....wow.....was too drunk and fumbling around for my specs (some bimbo who couldnt handle her booze knocked em off my head) to notice the guy.....

And yeah...the music sucked beyond description!

@ YMZA....they ARE all that you've described and much more! I'm a Thai myself and I have to put up with it....
I get it worse, due to the unwritten laws of Thai social conformity which I don't, never have, and never will fit into. Luv my country, but sometimes Id just love to say....stick it where the sun dun shine honey!

muah*
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3654

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What is it with fucking racism everywhere man? depresses me - it is like we are all herds of sheep led buy brainless rams.
London - all colours of the rainbow living side by side.. Yay! ... and picking fights and refusing to talk to each other...
Why are people not taken at face value as people? I understand we need to feel as though we belong, but why does that make people who are no like us less valuable? Why do we rule out people due to their appearance?
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3655

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@ YMZA

P.S. We Thais are BIIIIG of "face", so the best way to get things done here (sadly) is to not save face!

I say if we really want to make our point heard....it needs to go public.....

Shame that our community's only voice is a small section in the papers...on the weekend edition magazine? I might be mistaken....but the last I read on anything lgbt in the local papers is how the Chaingmai pride was shutdown...by cops themselves on behalf of the "MINISTRY OF CULTURE" as it was "degrading the Lanna culture"....ummm helooooo there are murals of courtiers tweaking each others' nipples plastered all over Palacial walls....

Amazing Thailand!
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3656

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Wow I hate that for Juliette too...

Now I understand the situation, though I am not sure my perspective. It is kind of akin to the Michigan Womyn's Music Festival in the US. The unwritten policy there is neither male-to female or female-to-male transsexuals are allowed though currently they have a co-policy of not questioning gender and ask that their policy be respected (as I understand it). I really would have liked to go this year, since might not be back in US again but stayed away because of that policy. It doesn't matter whether pre-op or post-op, they exclude transsexual women even if they don't enforce it. In the US there seems to be a variety of attitudes.

As a male-to-female transsexual who considers herself lesbian, I have found the lesbian community generally quite supportive. After my surgery the National Center for Lesbian Rights gave me legal advice when my employer decided my ex (though not yet my ex then) was not eligible for benefits. After a lot of yelling about the constitutional issues of voiding a previously recognized marriage they, along with the insurance and my retirement system relented. The NCLR provided me with invaluable advice. Most bars are welcoming, though I have heard of some in the US that are not. And I heard of at least one lesbian in the town where I lived who was a student worker in the library calling me "it."

I am surprised about the loud drag comment. They actually said that? That is ironic because some of my friends here who are kathoey have told me they cannot go to the lesbian pubs here (actually they are not interested either). My friends here say I am ok, nobody would know - I don't know. I stayed away from E-Fun and Zeta for a while because I was unsure whether I could get in - my friend I went with to E-Fun was very supportive. Actually when anyone wondered about my voice she simply told them I had a hormonal imbalance which is sort of true, at least early on... Her parents and coworkers accepted that, except one gay guy who went around saying lots of things at her work. I almost never wear jeans though because I am still self-conscious about things. I never dress in anything close to drag though, don't wear make-up. Makes me wonder what they would do if I showed up at the door.

Seems they were looking for a reason to exclude people, that is the only explanation for asking for IDs. I am not too concerned about that since my drivers license and passport both say female, though I don't like to carry my passport. I am tempted to try now just once to see what happens. I think my favorite place will remail E-Fun for the foreseeable future.

Though I am puzzled because I thought the two were connected, seems strange one should be so narrow and the other not. Heck at E-Fun, the person waiting on my table had a deeper voice than mine and looked more butch by far...

Juliette at least you are welcome here....

Grace
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3657

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@Yzma, I don't think that is true of the majority of Thai's at least that has not been my experience. Most Thais I have met have been wonderful, and I think Zeta is probably the exception (and I have heard of farang making scenes some places here, acting like Thailand is their playground and acting superior and demanding so I think some of that cuts both ways).

At least my experience with Thai people has been very positive overall, though I try to avoid the taxi drivers that will not use the meter. Actually I haven't used a taxi yet since I arrived here five weeks ago...

What Zeta did was intolerant, but to me that is not really Thailand. Most people here in the soi where I live are friendly,, as are the staff at the banks here and the Tesco...

Just my thoughts. As an American I find Thailand less xenophobic and more tolerant than the US, which I have little desire to go back to.:silly:

Anyway I agree Zeta does not seem a good place from what has been written, but I think E-Fun is more typical though they too have a policy of women only. That is why I worried when I went there, even though I have had surgery and my identification all says female. For sure I will patronize E-Fun in the future, when I can afford...
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3658

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@ Roxx....

Cos people are a bunch of insecure weaklings....yes we are social beings, but we take it to the extreme...exclusiveness....some like, and looooove to point at others....but forget that they're merely pointing at reflections of themselves!

@Granuaile...
True, there is a sign on the door at E-fun saying female patrons only....but, they were farrrrr more accommodating to "females" of all sorts!

The service is better, the staff are friendlier, etc...
I'm not aware that they're under the same management though.

The band there are also friendlier......
A Drag Show was even in the lineup last Saturday....and I was a bit rude, Id admit...walking around muttering I wanna party...not see drag! Heh....after downing vodka redbull since 6pm....

I'll post some shots I took...
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3659

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Thank you Ani, and Cee, and all you girls who were there with me that night, and all of you here voicing up on BangkokLesbian.

Since arriving in Bangkok, I've braced myself for negativity/rejection. None ever came, and I was -AM- very thankful for that. The community here at BKKLES has been nothing but welcoming and supporting. And I remember thinking that this could be like a home.

When zeta happened, it threw me totally. I didn't know how to react, and still don't actually. That's why I've been silent so far. But "Ghandi's approach" sounds like me.. (-8


@Ani - you're one of the most amazing persons I've ever had the fortune (800 generations' worth, in fact *wink) to meet. You'll change the world one day, and no one will be cheering harder for you than I.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3660

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@aniferk, well I don't care for drag either. Some of my kathoey friends invite me to go to cabaret shows and I make excuses not too. I'd rather party too, and I always think of the song the transsexual sings in Better Than Chocolate (who is in love with the butch bookstore owner) at the lesbian club - "I Ain't No F**king Drag Queen" nothing against drag queens, but all too often people don't distinguish between what for some people is a fetish and for some an affectation related to gay sexual orientation and for others is an identity. For me I have clear recollections from at least 7 years old that I was a girl. I really didn't know the biological difference at the time, I just knew who I was. :)

But my long-winded point (must be the Irish in me to take so long) is I would rather party too than see a drag show. That said I am going to see a cabaret next month with a lesbian friend but that is because I like doing things with her... not for the show...:silly:

@Juliette, sounds like at least E-Fun was good,... I have never experienced anything negative here, but in the US when I first transitioned, I had some problems with some of my coworkers who were very conservative (and older). And I was only allowed to use one rest-room on campus till after my surgery, and those same people tried to block me from the restroom on our floor even after surgery. But a letter from the university's attorney stopped that. I realized when I did this that there were going to be people who did not accept me and those who would. Mostly people have been ok everywhere...
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3661

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@ Grace....I wdv just whipped it out and whizzed all over the front of the restrooms...makin sure it lands inside the doors....cos technically...it's still the restroom, and ur standing outside! Woooooooo*

@Jules...sorry we had a bit of a tiff back then..but U know U got me back GIRL!
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3662

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Doin the Vogue
rIMG_0652.jpg
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3663

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@aniferk, Actually, I would not have done that and did not stand. One of their complaints was I left the seat up, when I didn't even stand, ... But they were a bunch of rednecks. I ran into one of them in the store a few days before I left the US (she retired long before me) and she barely acknowledged my presence. One of them and I mended our bridges later, but she was the only one that wasn't a bible-thumping hellfire and brimstone fundie redneck
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3664

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Was too drunk to remember what she was singing...
rIMG_0650.jpg
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3665

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@ Granouile....

I still would've, just for the entertaining pleasure of documenting their expressions and reactions!
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3666

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sorry I meant I got ur back...
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3668

Just my two cents.....


First off, I'm sorry to hear what happened to Juliette :( You totally have my 100% support.



About the Zeta incident, I think they overreacted and there might be some miscommunication, whether using the wrong words to tell you off ("They would happily welcome her back, if she were all garbed up in loud DRAG!") or getting the meaning lost in translation. Most Thais are not fluent in English.



Ok, here's a cultural thing.......

I must remind you that every lesbian bar in Thailand is EXTREMELY sensitive about letting a guy in their place. The bouncers will guard fiercely with any man who trying to get in. Nowadays, it becomes a big challenge for Thai males to win over lesbians because most of them are virgin, unlike straight girls at the same age.


Be warned that if you're a foreign trans without ID, chances are they won't let you in because they assume you're a man. Thais recognize their own trans ladies but not foreigners. If they assume one of your gang is a man, then, you're all doomed.




@Yzma

"TBH, I'm not surprised this happened. The lez scene in Bangkok is "clicky" to say the least and so many Thais are xenophobic and bigots, even amongst our own community. The image they like to portray that they are accepting of anyone is utter bullshit: they are not."

^
^

I have to disagree. I believe my country is one of the most gay tolerant (to be exact, gay friendly) in the world.


Look no further at our neighbor Malaysia and Indonesia where you're simply put in jail for being gay. And if you can name a single gay bar in Lao, Cambodia, Myanmar, and Vietnam...then, let me know because I have heard none.


Peace!
K
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3669

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the girls at zeta are less open minded than the thai society in general. i agree that thai society on a whole is very tolerant and has a great "live and let live" attitude. zeta, however, is very much into their idea of tom/dy and they work hard to propagate that. there's a lot of social pressure from within that community to conform, and that sucks.

one time at zeta there was a dy contest, and there was a man inside with a large camera from penthouse magazine (man's porn magazine). i followed him and watched him flip through photos on his camera - which were photos of porn. he was photographing the event, i'm assuming for penthouse mag.

i also know that a few of the dys who work at zeta are strippers for penthouse. so, to say they don't allow men in is wrong - they'll allow men in who benefit them in some way.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3670

@ cee

wow...that's sad :(

I used to buy Penthouse when I was a teenager. Now, I find it very tasteless.....lol
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3671

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@les in atlanta

Thanks for the cultural insight, and I can see the rationale in that. I agree that Thailand is a relatively tolerant country and certainly the most LTGB-friendly in this region. At this point in my life I would not choose any of them over Thailand, and the only other counties in this area I have considered living in are Vietnam and Indonesia (where it is possible for foreigners to own property and fairly easy to become a citizen). Probably outside China Indonesia is the only other country I would consider.

One correction though. Indonesia is actually also a rather tolerant country and being gay or trans there is not a criminal act. I have never been there, but I do have a few Indonesian friends, one a butch lesbian the other two straight women. Through them I have learned a lot. There are gay and lesbian clubs in Jakarta and I have been told my friend in other cities as well. She says that lesbians are fairly open there. One of my straight friends told me that a friend of hers is a co-owner of one lesbian pub, and she also (when she learned I was transsexual) told me about a celebrity in Indonesia named Dorce who is a male-to-female transsexual, describing her as the "Oprah of Indonesia" - Dorce is a talk show hostess, has been married (and divorced), adopted many children, made the Hajj twice, and is friendly with many of the countries politicians. I think sometimes people make assumptions about Indonesia, but it is a secular country where the true progressive character of Islam thrives in contrast to the fundamentalism of Malaysia.

About other countries I do not really know, but none of them seem to come close to the tolerance of Thailand. :cheer: Though Nepal is slated to legalize same-sex marriages because of a supreme court ruling.

Grace

les in atlanta wrote:

...
I have to disagree. I believe my country is one of the most gay tolerant (to be exact, gay friendly) in the world.


Look no further at our neighbor Malaysia and Indonesia where you're simply put in jail for being gay. And if you can name a single gay bar in Lao, Cambodia, Myanmar, and Vietnam...then, let me know because I have heard none.


Peace!
K
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3672

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Utopia Asia has listings for gay bars and gay-friendly businesses all over Asia:

www.utopia-asia.com/
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3675

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Cee, thanks, I have checked the listings there for Thailand but never Indonesia. Only one of the clubs my friend told me about was listed (or do not seem to be). But I noticed one club, Red Square, is mixed but trans people are banned.

Interesting. Anyway I will have to peruse the listings for other countries.

Grace
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3677

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@ Atlanta....

Being Thai, I am completely entitled to say this....stop excusing the incident!

It is typical Thai to excuse things...that other Thais do....oh maybe they didnt mean it that way?

Mistreating a fellow human being for their "gender/look" hypocritically when they had a MALE DJ spinning in there according to Agent_Lou, then telling her to come back in drag, makeup, women's clothing...WHATEVER it was they said...I wasn't quoting literally...is taken as it was intended. No "lost in translation" here hun.

Define "Tolerant"....where are our legal rights then?
It'll only be tolerant as long as it SAVES FACE, or fits SOCIAL NORMS and WHAT IS CONSIDERED ACCEPTABLE!

How else would we describe men "TOM/DEE BASHING"?

I had a guy, knew in College come up to me once and said I just never had the GOOD STUFF...and I just haven't been F***ed to 7th heaven n back. Go figure what I did to his balls and his face as he was crouched on the ground!

And I was unaware that we need a PENIS to be devirginized!

"The bouncers will guard fiercely with any man who trying to get in. Nowadays, it becomes a big challenge for Thai males to win over lesbians because most of them are virgin, unlike straight girls...."

Uhhh nope...they're rabid dogs who would guard any1 who dont fit into their perfect little Butch/Femme idealism.

And Thai men have always been misogynistic....rampant polygamy (even to this day..which disgustingly is also a common trait amongst butches, some...not all)is still commonly found and typically joked about in the usual Thai "WHY SO SERIOUS" way....

According to law, if a Man wants to leave his wife, he could easily cry adultery with no need of proof and is not required to provide child support, however if it is the woman who wants a divorce, she will need to go through hell to provide proof which will have to go through the Man's lawyers' scrutinizing in court!

"I must remind you that every lesbian bar in Thailand is EXTREMELY sensitive about letting a guy in their place"

OK, Male DJs? Male Photographers?...worse than that from Penthouse? FILTH!

"@Yzma

"TBH, I'm not surprised this happened. The lez scene in Bangkok is "clicky" to say the least and so many Thais are xenophobic and bigots, even amongst our own community. The image they like to portray that they are accepting of anyone is utter bullshit: they are not."

^
I have to disagree. I believe my country is one of the most gay tolerant (to be exact, gay friendly) in the world. "

i grew up multicultural...I see things from different perspectives. I love my country and my people, but when I see wrong, I don't encourage it by passively saying "Mai Pen Rai"

People sitting at cabaret shows entertained by the trans performers do not mean they tolerate them, in fact even worse...they see them as a form of entertainment...that's all....when you laugh at someone, it never means you respect them!
Look at the menial jobs in society left for lgbts to do...entertainers....bus drivers....cleaners....etc...
Name a company (traditional Thai system) that would allow a butch to wear slacks/shirt/tie? Government offices still make these women wear skirts to work...which I know from talking to some, is extremely uncomfortable, and begets the ridicule common among some socially inept Thais.

And again, why am I not surprised that when discussing social grievances relevant to Thailand, the finger is directed to our neighbors? The point here is THAILAND.....Bangkok, Zeta. It's no wonder why our neighbors despise us so much...it's the Thai mentality of superiority....when we really haven't accomplished that much...at the end of the day, we're still a 3rd world country. And countries not having "Gay Bars" do not mean they don't tolerate family. So again, it's not about what we see on the surface(No gay bars = no tolerance?), but it's how we treat one another that communicates tolerance, acceptance, sisterhood, and most importantly,
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
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@YZMA, I only partly agree with you because I have met Butch/femme friends who are Thai, and are nowhere near being bigots, but then again we dont run with that crowd anyway.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3679

  • Duangkamol
  • Duangkamol's Avatar
Hmmm, am I reading some of the comments right, that they should not exclude men?

I know Juliette off the forum, and I am sorry about what happened. But I agree with the policy of no-men at E-Fun and Zeta, I think perhaps they need to explicitly say in their policy what it is towards women with a transsexual history and what factors determine admission. I do not think requiring one to present as female is an unreasonable request of a woman with a transsexual history in a lesbian club. Perhaps they should have shown some flexibility in this situation since she was in the company of many from this forum, but there does need to be some sort of demarcation. Things are not usually black or white, but there has to be at least a grey line at some place I would have no interest in going to either if it were just like any other gay or straight club, there are reasons I don't go to straight or gay male clubs. I just feel sorry for Juliette and the others who got caught up in this, but I do not want the clubs to change their no men policy. Even if they decided to exclude me... I would be hurt but like the MWMF I would survive...

Grace

Grace
Last Edit: 4 years 11 months ago by Duangkamol.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3682

@aniferk

.....lol...sis, you really see red!


Maybe, some day I'll be angry enough to say so much. I always look for the bright side. I can be a politically-motivated criminal but not for the topic discussed here.


What we have in Thailand is so precious. It's not perfect but it's not bad like you make it sound.


Sometimes, the admission issue can be solved diplomatically. I was denied at the gate once (at different place) but finding a way to talk it out. This kind of business won't last very long if they keep pissing off people.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3683

  • Duangkamol
  • Duangkamol's Avatar
@les in atlanta I think you are right about using diplomacy to resolve issues like this.

I know Juliette so my inclination is to feel sympathy for her, and I could possibly find myself in the same situation albeit as a post-op woman with a transsexual history. But despite biases I think the situation has to be looked at clearly and balanced. When something involves people we know, we sometimes have a knee-jerk reaction and fail to look at the entire picture. And more often than not things can be talked through most of the time or a compromise reached.

Grace
Last Edit: 4 years 11 months ago by Duangkamol.
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Re:GIRLS, LADIES, AND FRIENDS, GIRLCOT ZETA!!!!!!!!!! 4 years 11 months ago #3684

B) just wanna show my support.

i have absolutely zero tolerence on this. what happened it's totally messed up. i never been to this place (driving by sometimes when i go driving range). I guess i don't like "label" concept that you got to be either or (i.e butch or femme)in general - but treating ppl like this? though within their right to refuse service, it's totally unacceptable !

therefore, i join your call for girlcott this place. right on! sis- thanks for bringing this up for our attention

I can see why you guys are so upset (i am too) but think again there will always be asshole like this coming on your path once in a while. so i'd say "f*uck them " and move on - focus your energy to educate or help out ppl you really deserve your time/attention ( i.e. help fight world's hunger, climate changes)
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